Re: [Politics_CurrentEvents_Group] Re: : Correcting Fantasies About Social Security

What does that have to do with anything?
----- Original Message -----
From: "zeus32117" <zeus32117@yahoo.com>
To: <Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2011 6:14 PM
Subject: [Politics_CurrentEvents_Group] Re: : Correcting Fantasies About
Social Security

Her two granddaughters make enough money to be able to take care of her.
They would be doing exactly that if they had to do it. Her two children can
take care of her too.

--- In Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com, "Sheep&Goatlady"
<springcreek@...> wrote:
>
> How do you know she does not need it?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "zeus32117" <zeus32117@...>
> To: <Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2011 6:48 PM
> Subject: [Politics_CurrentEvents_Group] Re: : Correcting Fantasies About
> Social Security
>
>
> What I am saying is that much of the time the government takes from those
> who have less and gives it to those who have more. The widow whom I was
> talking about does not need financial assistance from the government. She
> receives it anyway. Last year 40% of the money the U.S. federal government
> had spent was borrowed, according to the numbers that I have seen.
>
> --- In Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com, "Sheep&Goatlady"
> <springcreek@> wrote:
> >
> > if you check,, you will find that widow is paying more for her medicare
> > than
> > those that has less,, So she get SS,, so what? some one paid into it,
> > Ah,,
> > I suggest you check how SS is determined,, it is determined on how much
> > the
> > person made in their life time and paid into SS,, I see you have no idea
> > how
> > SS nor medicare works,, the cap for paying into SS is 110,000,, after
> > that
> > no SS is taken out of their check,, and I think the maz is like 2000 a
> > month for a family,, in SS ,,
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "zeus32117" <zeus32117@>
> > To: <Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 7:39 PM
> > Subject: [Politics_CurrentEvents_Group] Re: : Correcting Fantasies About
> > Social Security
> >
> >
> > I will break down for you the statement that you were responding to. In
> > other words, I will say what I have said already but in way that is
> > easier
> > to understand. What I have said is that I am in favor of finding an
> > alternative. An alternative to what am I talking about? I am talking
> > about
> > an alternative to reducing government spending. I am referring to
> > finding
> > a
> > good alternative to reducing how much money the government is spending
> > on
> > each of those people who need help the most.
> >
> > The government is spending money on both people who need help and on
> > people
> > who do not need help from the government. For example, I know a widow
> > who
> > had more than U.S.$600,000 in savings when her husband had died. She was
> > receiving her Social Security benefits anyway. She still does. The
> > Medicare
> > was and still is paying for much of the medical services that she was
> > receiving and still receives. I think that some of that money probably
> > comes
> > from taxes that are paid by people who do not make much money. The rest
> > of
> > it could be coming from taxes paid by those people who are forced to
> > borrow
> > money in order not to go out of business.
> >
> >
> > --- In Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com, "Sheep&Goatlady"
> > <springcreek@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Reduce the amount of money? how is that? less medical care, put them
> > > in
> > > poor
> > > housing conditiosn, less education, is that your idea?
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "zeus32117" <zeus32117@>
> > > To: <Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 5:19 AM
> > > Subject: [Politics_CurrentEvents_Group] Re: : Correcting Fantasies
> > > About
> > > Social Security
> > >
> > >
> > > I agree with you that circumstances beyond someone's control can do
> > > that
> > > to
> > > someone. That's one of the reasons why I am in favor of finding a good
> > > alternative to reducing the amount of money that the government spends
> > > on
> > > each of those people who need help the most.
> > >
> > > --- In Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com, "Sheep&Goatlady"
> > > <springcreek@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I am glad to hear that, but circumstances beyond one's control can
> > > > wipe
> > > > you
> > > > out,
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "zeus32117" <zeus32117@>
> > > > To: <Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 7:53 PM
> > > > Subject: [Politics_CurrentEvents_Group] Re: : Correcting Fantasies
> > > > About
> > > > Social Security
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I save as much money as I can save. I am not counting on ever
> > > > receiving
> > > > anything from the government.
> > > >
> > > > --- In Politics_CurrentEvents_Group@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Majors
> > > > <majors.bruce@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > *Quote of the Day: * ". . . entitlement to Social Security
> > > > > benefits
> > > > > is
> > > > > not
> > > > > a
> > > > > contractual right" -- The U.S. Supreme Court, ruling in Flemming
> > > > > v.
> > > > > Nestor
> > > > > (1960).
> > > > >
> > > > > The feedback we received about our Social Security campaign makes
> > > > > it
> > > > > obvious
> > > > > that many people have been seriously misled by political saviors.
> > > > > What
> > > > > follows is for those who prefer fact to fantasy . . .
> > > > >
> > > > > The story of one person can tell the whole story of Social
> > > > > Security.
> > > > > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_(United_States)#Implementation>
> > > > >
> > > > > Ida Fuller, a law secretary from Vermont, was the first person to
> > > > > receive
> > > > > monthly Social Security checks.
> > > > >
> > > > > * Her first check came on February 1, 1940.
> > > > > * By the time she received this check she had paid a total of
> > > > > $24.75
> > > > > into
> > > > > the Social Security System.
> > > > > * Her first check was for $22.54.
> > > > > * By the time Fuller received her second check she had already
> > > > > received
> > > > > more
> > > > > than she had contributed to Social Security.
> > > > > * She lived to be 100 and collected a total of $22,888.92.
> > > > >
> > > > > It should be perfectly clear to anyone who can handle basic math,
> > > > > that
> > > > > Ms.
> > > > > Fuller's benefits did NOT come from amounts she had contributed
> > > > > into
> > > > > a
> > > > > trust
> > > > > fund. Instead . . .
> > > > >
> > > > > Ms. Fuller's benefits came from the Social Security taxes paid by
> > > > > her
> > > > > children and grand-children over the remaining 35 years of her
> > > > > life.
> > > > > In
> > > > > other words, the taxes WE pay go to fund the benefits of previous
> > > > > generations, NOT our own benefits.
> > > > >
> > > > > *The way Social Security functioned for Ida Fuller is how it still
> > > > > operates
> > > > > today. *
> > > > >
> > > > > * Social Security benefits do NOT come out of a trust fund
> > > > > * They do NOT come from payments beneficiaries have made to the
> > > > > system
> > > > > * There was NEVER any trust fund
> > > > > * Payments into the system have always been LESS than the size of
> > > > > future
> > > > > obligations
> > > > > * Current taxpayers have always paid for the benefits of previous
> > > > > generations, NOT their own benefits
> > > > >
> > > > > *So why do politicians talk about a trust fund? There are two
> > > > > reasons
> > > > > .
> > > > > .
> > > > > .
> > > > > *
> > > > >
> > > > > First, politicians are con artists. They lie. Just because they
> > > > > use
> > > > > the
> > > > > words "trust fund," and even include those words in legislation,
> > > > > does
> > > > > NOT
> > > > > mean that such a fund actually exists. The Social Security Trust
> > > > > Fund
> > > > > is
> > > > > a
> > > > > legal fiction. There are NO actual funds being held in trust.
> > > > > Instead
> > > > > .
> > > > > .
> > > > > .
> > > > >
> > > > > *All Social Security taxes are spent as soon as they're received.*
> > > > >
> > > > > Second, in 1983 the Social Security tax was raised a little higher
> > > > > than
> > > > > was
> > > > > needed to keep paying current benefits. This surplus was then
> > > > > spent
> > > > > by
> > > > > the
> > > > > politicians on other things. Treasury Bonds equal to the surplus
> > > > > income
> > > > > from
> > > > > Social Security taxes were then credited to the so-called Social
> > > > > Security
> > > > > Trust Fund, but . . .
> > > > >
> > > > > *These bonds are essentially worthless, because . . . *
> > > > >
> > > > > The real source of the money to pay future benefits will be future
> > > > > taxes,
> > > > > NOT bond redemptions.
> > > > >
> > > > > * Money to pay off these bonds will come from taxes that will then
> > > > > be
> > > > > paid
> > > > > to Social Security recipients, so . . .
> > > > > * If you ignored the bonds entirely and just took the taxes and
> > > > > gave
> > > > > them
> > > > > directly to Social Security recipients, you could bypass the
> > > > > ceremonial,
> > > > > bond-redemption process
> > > > >
> > > > > Let's bring the Trust Fund lie down to a very personal level . . .
> > > > >
> > > > > You can't create an asset by writing yourself an IOU. If you take
> > > > > $10
> > > > > out
> > > > > of
> > > > > your right pocket, spend the $10, and then write yourself an IOU
> > > > > for
> > > > > $10,
> > > > > the IOU is worthless, EVEN if you place it in your Left-pocket
> > > > > Trust
> > > > > Fund.
> > > > >
> > > > > The Social Security Trust Fund is really the Left-pocket Trust
> > > > > Fund.
> > > > >
> > > > > And these so-called bonds are just another political con-job
> > > > > designed
> > > > > to
> > > > > dupe the American people.
> > > > >
> > > > > But what if you took these bonds seriously?
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, they still wouldn't amount to much. As Robert Samuelson of
> > > > > the
> > > > > Washington Post has observed: "The trust fund's $2.6 trillion
> > > > > would
> > > > > provide
> > > > > only 3.5 years of benefits."
> > > > > <http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/06/AR2011030602926.html?wpisrc=nl_opinions>
> > > > >
> > > > > Meanwhile, the unfunded future liabilities for Social Security
> > > > > amount
> > > > > to
> > > > > many tens of trillions of dollars. This huge burden will crush the
> > > > > life
> > > > > out
> > > > > of future taxpayers, or result in huge benefit cuts, unless action
> > > > > is
> > > > > taken
> > > > > soon to lower costs in ways that won't hurt those who are
> > > > > dependent
> > > > > on
> > > > > Social Security.
> > > > >
> > > > > It is to achieve these goals that we have made our proposals about
> > > > > Social
> > > > > Security. We hope you will be moved to support our effort. You can
> > > > > send
> > > > > a
> > > > > letter to Congress using DownsizeDC.org's Educate the Powerful
> > > > > System.<https://secure.downsizedc.org/etp/campaigns/142>
> > > > >
> > > > > Here's what I wrote in my personal comments, which you can borrow
> > > > > from
> > > > > or
> > > > > copy . . .
> > > > >
> > > > > The old and the young must protect each other. Otherwise, America
> > > > > will
> > > > > go
> > > > > bankrupt, like Greece. And when that happens real, deep, painful
> > > > > cuts
> > > > > will
> > > > > be FORCED on America's seniors in the most inconvenient way at the
> > > > > most
> > > > > inconvenient time. Therefore . . .
> > > > >
> > > > > * Slowly raise the retirement age. I'm asking you to do this even
> > > > > though
> > > > > it
> > > > > will impact me, directly. I'll pay this price.
> > > > >
> > > > > * Means-test benefits so that we don't cripple young people for
> > > > > the
> > > > > benefit
> > > > > of those who have independent means of support.
> > > > >
> > > > > * Reduce Social Security's future unfunded liabilities by allowing
> > > > > young
> > > > > people to forgo future benefits for the sake of lower taxes now.
> > > > >
> > > > > * Cut other spending so as to enhance the Social Security opt-out
> > > > > for
> > > > > young
> > > > > people. Make real cuts, not the puny cuts Congress has debated so
> > > > > far.
> > > > > Include sacred cows, like so-called national defense and the
> > > > > Department
> > > > > of
> > > > > Education.
> > > > >
> > > > > END LETTER
> > > > >
> > > > > Please educate and recruit people to help by sharing this Dispatch
> > > > > with
> > > > > others.
> > > > >
> > > > > Jim Babka
> > > > > President
> > > > > DownsizeDC.org, Inc.
> > > > >
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